Episode 483 Charles Watkins Faith and Resilience After Military Service Transcript

This transcript is from episode 483 with guest Charles Watkins.

Scott DeLuzio: [00:00:00] Before we dive into this episode, make sure you’re subscribed to our newsletter at Drive On Podcast dot com slash subscribe. You’ll get my five favorite episodes sent straight to your inbox. No fluff, just the best insights to help you drive on you ever feel like no one understands what you’re going through.

The struggle to transition back to civilian life, the weight of mental health battles, or just that deep need for a tribe that truly gets you. Could faith be the missing piece to resilience? Today we’re talking with Army veteran Charles Watkins, founder of Breaking the Silence, an organization dedicated to supporting veterans and first responders through faith, community, and real world support, we’re breaking down how faith intersects with resilience, the power of comradery, and why finding purpose after service might start with simply reaching out.

So let’s get into it.

wanna welcome to the show Charles. Really glad to have you here.

Charles Watkins: Thank you so much. I’m [00:01:00] really glad to be here.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, absolutely. So, can you maybe start by sharing a bit about your own military experience and maybe how that influenced your your path to founding veterans ministry?

Charles Watkins: Right. So actually I changed up the name, the name is now, it became breaking the Silence. And the reason that I changed it is because I don’t know if having ministry in the title or. Well, you know, it, it seems like that some people may be hesitant. Especially like I was reaching out to churches and they just, they, they were kind of hesitant.

And I think it’s coming May, maybe it was coming across as like, it, it’s a ministry, you know, specifically for veterans. So I tried to change it up. You know, especially because I kind of feel like that military suicide, even law enforcement, suicide is something that, you know, it’s not really talked about, you know, in.

I would say at the, the level that regular suicide is talked about when it’s general, you know, generalized to everybody. So that’s the reason for the change. But my military experience, it it, it, it, it played a, [00:02:00] a very significant role in shaping the vision that I have for this ministry. ’cause when I was in, I served as a chaplain assistant and then.

It was there where the chaplain would make me do prayers and things like that. And I’m like, I don’t want to hear, you know, none of this stuff, man, I’m fine. But actually I got out and when I got out, we were living with my sister-in-law. We didn’t have anywhere to go, and we started renting a house from a preacher.

So every time I go to pay the rent, the preacher would be like, Hey, why don’t you come to church? No, sir. I’m all right. Appreciate it. But no, and, and I think part of that stemmed from, because I, I grew up in the Catholic church and there’s a lot of standing kneeling and a lot of just seriousness. And, and so finally after he asked me for the hundredth time, I said, you know what?

I’ll go. And then after that I just, you know, with the experience that I had, I, I just kind of, you know, that’s when I started going to church and, and it really started taking shape. But, so as a chaplain assistant, we did a lot of providing support. We had 800 soldiers in our unit and their family [00:03:00] members that we had to provide, whether it was just counseling, crisis intervention, whatever the case may be.

And it was very, very mentally draining. But and through that role I saw firsthand though the, the emotional spiritual and mental struggles that. Many service members were facing, especially when it comes to combat people dealing with things like PTSD and trying to transition back into civilian life.

And when I left the military, I had a very, very hard time readjusting. I was actually, I was getting in the car and I was driving to the Pennsylvania border ’cause I’m originally from there and I would drive. Then I would turn around and just come right back to South Carolina. And finally after about two weeks, my wife’s like, Hey, you can’t do this no more.

You know, it’s costing a lot to, you know, just take a trip. So I’m like, okay. But she helped me. She was, she was pretty, she was one of the main reasons I was able to get through it, even though she didn’t really understand. She was there to support me in everything that I needed. But after I left the military, I continued working in law enforcement.

I was supervising sex offenders and probation and parole, and then [00:04:00] I’d even encountered veterans and probation and parole who were struggling with addiction and homelessness and mental health challenges, and then start doing the research. And you find out that. At the time when I was doing it, 22 veterans a day were committing suicide.

One service member a day, and then law enforcement, you know, was also above the national average. So, that’s why I really founded the ministry to cater to those who may feel like that nobody understands, or that even that, you know, they’re being left behind.

Scott DeLuzio: And I think it’s important to point out too that that there is a comradery that’s lost when you get out of that, that military environment. Even law enforcement or you know, I’ve, I’ve never served in a law enforcement capacity, but from people I’ve spoken to you know, the, the folks that you serve with in whatever capacity that you’re serving, they sort of understand and kind of get what, where you’re coming from with some of the struggles and, and things.

And you can open up to them a little bit more and just talk like, man, that was [00:05:00] crazy. You know, that, that experience, right? But when. You walk into your, your cubicle at your office, whatever, whatever you might be working at in the, you know, civilian world. And something’s been bugging you from your time in the military, you’re not gonna just open up to the guy in the next cubicle and just start talking about, man, this crazy night when this, all this stuff went down and you know, it’s really been been getting at me.

So you kinda lose that comradery with those other people that you served with who do have a little bit of understanding maybe. They weren’t there with you at the time that whatever this incident might, might have been that we might be talking about, they may not have been there, but they, they can certainly relate to it because they’ve probably had some experiences similar enough to it that, that they can understand where you’re coming from and.

Charles Watkins: Yep.

Scott DeLuzio: I, I think that’s, that’s a huge component of it, right? But then when you take things like religion and faith, spirituality, all of these, [00:06:00] these things, when you, you kind of combine them together with these issues that people might be facing, people will, I would imagine, start to have a little bit easier of a time healing when they’re allowing this. To enter their lives, right? Where, where maybe they, they never went to church growing up as, as a kid, and they didn’t, it’s, I don’t know, maybe it’s a little bit scary to them and they’re not sure what to expect. I don’t mean scary as in like, you know. Boo. Kind of scary, you know, but like, you know, it’s just, it’s that fear of the unknown.

It’s like, I don’t know what, what I’m, what am I getting into? They can be brainwashing me or something. Like, who knows what’s, what’s going on with this? But when you, you, you’re like, okay, well there’s other folks here who are similar enough to me. Maybe I, maybe I can let my guard down a little bit and I can actually open up and talk about some of these things.

May, maybe that’s. That, that first step into [00:07:00] this, this sort of healing, right?

Charles Watkins: Yep. And, and, and you know, when we talk about like, the intersection of like faith. And resilience, you know, they kind of go hand in hand, especially for veterans who have faced trauma loss and, and different challenges of, like I said, trying to transition back into civilian life. But I’ve seen firsthand how faith can be a powerful foundation for healing and perseverance, and that’s kind of why I try to incorporate, you know, the, the ministry but also.

Just regular mental health resources for, you know, people who may not at the moment be into that. They don’t wanna have nothing to do with it. And that’s fine there, you know, but there has to be a balance to where you can reach people at a spiritual level who want it, but you can also reach people who, you know, don’t want it.

I kind of think that you know, the, the biggest key here is, is trying to take the people who are struggling the most and, and bring them into a nurturing environment with, like you said, people who understand that they may not have been there with me that night.

They may not have, you know, went through the exact same thing, but, you know, [00:08:00] we, we were all in the suck together or.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, that’s right. Even within the different MOS’s you know, you might have a, an infantry or MP or someone in finance, I don’t know. Someone in, in your, your role too as a chaplain assistant. There are different things that people experience. You know, there a lot of times deployments you know, o overseas and you see different things.

It doesn’t matter what your job is, there could be a mortar attack on your base, and just because you were in finance doesn’t mean that you didn’t experience that. Right? Someone like yourself, a, a chaplain assistant who is. Going to people who are very often in kind of the lows of their, the lows of their relationships.

You know, a lot of you, you mentioned some of the issues that, that people might, might be going through their, you know, spiritual issues that they might be dealing with or, I don’t, I don’t know. It’s, that’s a lot of weight for any one person to kind of carry as well. So, no matter [00:09:00] what the job is there, there’s stresses that come along with it.

And knowing that there’s somebody else there who, who kind of gets the overall big picture of this is the military, this is the military life, this is what we all signed up for, and to support in one way or another, and. You, you at least have that baseline understanding, right? Where, whereas in a civilian environment, you may not have that.

So I, I, I, I can appreciate where you’re coming from with all of that. Right. And then talking about. That intersection of faith and resilience. Right. Re resilience. I mean, that, that’s, that’s a whole big can of worms. You know, that we, we can, we can open up, we can go down that road, but but there’s a lot of different ways that you can support someone in a, you know, to become more resilient.

Lots of different emotional, spiritual type things. Are, are there different programs or, or different things that you utilize in, in your ministry that. Helps to promote that type of stuff [00:10:00] through, through this program.

Charles Watkins: Yeah. So, on the website what I did was I took cri, I found Crisis Intervention online, and what I did was I took ones for military first responders. I. And even just ones where regular people can reach out. So that would be tailored more to your family members. And I put those right on the front of the website, you know, I wanna make sure that’s, if you’re in the crisis, hey, here you go.

And it connect them whether they want phone, text, chat, whatever. It’ll connect them right away. And then what I did was I put just a bunch of resources on the website different links to VA things and different things to like, finding a treatment locator for like substance abuse, things like that.

So it was put a lot of resources onto the website and, and trying to engage with people. Like I had a I sent out emails, I was sending ’em out to churches and I really wasn’t getting many responses. And I get a call from a guy and he says, Hey look, I don’t know if you do this, but we have a guy here, he’s a retired colonel and he’s in the early [00:11:00] stages of dementia and there’s no homes, you know, for, for veterans around here.

And then I was able to start looking at that so I can start adding that to the website. There’s a lot of different, you know, things that people are facing and I’m trying to, you know, my best that if people reach out to me like, Hey, this is a need we’re facing. And I did the research for that guy and they said, Hey, this is what I came up with.

I gave him a list of different people that provide such services but just try to take an approach to where we can support. Recognize that people need healing and, and to be resilient. And that requires emotional, sometimes spiritual and community-based solutions where, you know, it’s not just, it could be a one-on-one thing, but when you have, I kind of feel like when you have a group of people who have all been through the same thing and they all share a common experience, you’re more likely to open up to ’em.

And it’s just, it’s just a better overall experience when you know that there’s a bunch of people, hey, that, that, that feel like I do.

Scott DeLuzio: Right. Well, it, it’s just like if you, if you go back to military days [00:12:00] for, for anyone’s out there listening who is a veteran, right? That you had your group of people that you would, you’d hang out with and you’d be able to just talk about stuff and.

Charles Watkins: Yep.

Scott DeLuzio: It, it wasn’t like a structured therapy session. It was just, you know, maybe a bunch of guys just talking about, you know, whatever whatever came to mind.

Sometimes it’s stupid stuff that, that comes to mind, but that kind of develops that connection, that bond, the comradery that we were talking about before. It, it creates all of that which opens up an environment where now when something a little bit more serious comes up, you have this opportunity, you can, you can just talk about someone, you know, you, you lose someone you know, in a, whether it’s in a firefight or you know, whatever.

Like, that’s pretty serious. And so now you have this environment where, yeah, sure I can, I can joke with these guys that I’ve been talking with forever, but I, I feel like I can also talk to ’em about something a [00:13:00] little bit more serious too. And yeah, sure. They, they may. You know, crack a joke or, or something like that to try to keep the mood light.

But they, they’re doing it from a, a, you know, place I think, of understanding where they, they understand where you’re coming from. Yeah. Cool. You got it off your chest. Now let’s, let’s try to help heal, heal each other. Right? And so that, that comes from that group environment though, right?

Charles Watkins: yep. And I think another big thing is I think having veterans in different places in life is also something that. Should not go unnoticed. Such as, I was watching a video the other day where a veteran with PTSD was standing there saying he wanted the cops to kill him. He was trying to do, you know, death or you know, suicide by cop.

And another cop who was a veteran was able to talk him down from it, you know, and at the end he got all emotional because, you know, it’s.

Scott DeLuzio: Hmm.

Charles Watkins: You know, had, had a veteran not shown up, you know, maybe the outcome would’ve been different. Someone that didn’t understand what that guy was going through. So, you know, it’s [00:14:00] just having that, that community oriented support system, I think is is, is, is what’s really needed for veterans to know that, hey, there’s other people out here who I can depend on.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, for sure. And I, I also think from conversations that I’ve had with. Many, many people over the, the last few years through doing this podcast that service to other people is a big a big thing that will help. Seems like just about anybody with their own struggles and issues they may be going from going through you know, and, and that service could be in so many different forms.

It could be you know, helping out at a, a veteran’s hospital. It could be you know, helping the homeless or helping, I don’t know, taking care of dogs at a animal shelter or whatever it is. It’s just serving, it, it provides you with a sense of purpose, I feel like, sense of meaning in, in your life.

And I, I could see just from you through first off, you know, serving in the [00:15:00] military and then continuing that work and continuing the, the service that you’re doing now through this ministry that. It seems like a key component of your life. How do you see it though, in as far as maybe within your own life, but also for other people?

Do, do you see services being kind of a you know, an avenue for people to grow and transform in their own lives?

Charles Watkins: Absolutely. You know, when I was younger, I used to be a very self-centered person. You know, and, and, and a lot of people, you know, they. They don’t really understand this, but not everybody signs up for the military because they wanna serve their country, or, or they’re super proud of America. You know, when I joined the military, it was because there was no jobs.

I had nothing. And so I, I needed something. And I joined, and after joining and, and doing something where I was serving something other than myself, it, it kind of walked me into becoming, you know, not so selfish and wanting to you know, serve others. [00:16:00] And for example, it seems like ever since then I’ve just been in a constant state of serving people, whether it was you know, stepping up to fill a role at the church when the youth needed a leader, or my neighbor, he, I had a couple neighbors who fell. One neighbor fell. He had covid. I ran in, you know, to help ’em off the floor.

Another one was all bloody he was super drunk, fell over. And, and he was an elderly guy. I helped him up no problem. But it seems like that it just, it’s like became the center of my life. But it, it, I, I noticed, like I said, when you serve, it’s kinda like you shift your focus from yourself and it goes to the needs of others.

And then the shift brings a perspective of gratitude and deeper sense of purpose for veterans and first responders with many whom struggle with a loss of identity after their service ends. Stepping into a role where they can help others can be inc be healing. It can be a healing, you know, not just for the people who you’re helping, but for yourself.

And it reminds them that they’re everything that [00:17:00] they, everything they learned in the military, it’s in, in all the sacrifices that were made. It, it still has meaning.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, it does. And through a a, a group like this, like where you have a, you know, a bunch of people coming together, you know, and. Someone’s gonna be having it probably worse off than you are, and somebody else is gonna be doing a little bit better than, than somebody else. And you know, you, you can all help lift each other up as opposed to, you know, stepping on top of each other, trying to get yourself out.

You, you can help lift each other up. And I think that’s kind of where I see the, the benefit of this is, is there’s that, that collective effort, like we all want to. Get better. We all want to help each other out. And, and when you have people, especially a bunch of military folks coming together I mean, I don’t know there’s anything you can’t accomplish, right?

Charles Watkins: Yep. Yep. I agree. And, and, and [00:18:00] to add on to that, you know, I, I kind of feel like that service, it helps to build that resilience that we talked about earlier, and when, when, when you walk with others through their struggles, whether it’s mentoring another veteran, supporting someone in the crisis, or just even lending, you know, like a listening ear.

You gain strength. You know how to just help them gain strength, but you also gain it in, you know, in your own journey. And you realize that. Adversity doesn’t have to define who you are. It doesn’t have to define your situation. It can equip you to actually make a difference.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, it does. It, it does allow you to, I come from maybe a, a place of understanding for other people who are going through something similar or, or maybe not even similar, but just something difficult. It’s like, Hey, I’ve been through something difficult too, and I know it sucks and it’s hard.

And I know, I don’t know exactly what you’re going through, but I know it’s not easy and you know, I, I can be here just to shut up and listen if, if that’s what you need, you know? And, [00:19:00] you know, so you kind of have a little bit better idea of what is going on with that other person.

Charles Watkins: Yep. Another thing I noticed, oh, I’m sorry. I didn’t,

Scott DeLuzio: No, no, go ahead.

Charles Watkins: alright. Another thing that I noticed is, is that in the military, and I, I don’t know if it’s like it’s in other branches, but at least within the Army confidentiality is it, it’s on a whole nother level. So for example. If someone would come in and tell you something, you can’t tell anybody else.

So like me and the chaplain, it it. It was us. That was it. So if, for example, if he was off at someone’s, you know, doing a home visit and I remained back at the office and like the commanding officer came in, Hey, where’s the chaplain? I was like, sir, I, I don’t know if I can tell you, you know? And are you, are you effing with me, Watkins?

No, sir. Listen, I mean, no disrespect. I just, I don’t know if I can tell you, you’d have to call the chaplain. But it even goes so far as like, if, if. If we were both in the military and you told me something as the chaplain assistant and then you died. If I ever wanted to tell anybody that I [00:20:00] would have to go to your next akin to be able to release whatever it is you told me.

And, and they teach you that when you’re in school to become a chaplain assistant. Hey, even if you go to court and the judge says, you tell me right now. You’re going to jail. You’re going to jail. You, you, you don’t tell. And I think there’s something to be said with that, because. I noticed that places like the VA or even just counselors in general, they give you the statement up front like, Hey, if you tell, tell me anything that checks one of these boxes, I’m calling the law enforcement on you, or I’m calling somebody on you.

And sometimes, you know, people just wanna vent and they may say things in the heat of the moment that they don’t actually mean and, and you know, I think that letting people know that, hey. I’m not just gonna run off and, and, and, and call law enforcement on you just because you may have said something, but there, there needs to be a place where veterans can vent to where they don’t have fear of repercussion trying to get something off their chest, because then I honestly think that that really leads to a suppression of certain things that [00:21:00] they really wanna say.

Scott DeLuzio: Well, yeah, exactly. And I, I know, you know, veterans are, they’re, they’re gonna keep that stuff in if they feel like there’s any chance that that’s gonna get out and yeah, I’m gonna have the law enforcement called on me because I said. The wrong thing, or I’m gonna have someone knocking on my door coming to take my guns away or something because I said something and it’s like, well, we don’t, we don’t want that to have to happen.

And you know, so like that, that for me, honestly, you know, in my own story, going back to, you know, why didn’t I get help sooner? Well, that was kind of part of it. I mean, it wasn’t the whole thing, but it, I mean, in the back of my mind I was like, I don’t know. What’s gonna happen? As soon as I say, Hey, I, I need some help.

They’re gonna come take all my guns away. They’re gonna come lock me up and, you know, put me away someplace just, you know, until I, you know, get whatever kind of help that they’re, they’re offering or shove whatever pills they’re, they’re [00:22:00] gonna shove down my throat or, or whatever. And so for me, and, and it was kinda like the fear of the unknown for me.

It, it was, it was like, I just didn’t know what I didn’t know either. And, and so, and I, I didn’t really have. Anybody that I felt like I could just talk to about this, you know, like where I, I felt like this is gonna be safe. I can ca talk to this person and they’re gonna be knowledgeable o of whatever it is that I’m asking about.

But the funny thing was when I would start to go for, and now this, I’m taking a step away from spiritual side here, but just, you know, mental health treatment in general and, and I think is kind of along the lines of what we were talking about anyways. But as I would go to my appointments.

There’d be guys that I served with coming outta the appointment. Like they had the appointment just before me. And I was like, oh, you know, I could, I could have talked to that guy and he would’ve like understood what I was talking about because he was coming outta this appointment too. And you know it.

So you know, like a lot of times you might have that [00:23:00] fear of, geez, I don’t, I don’t know. Can I actually talk to someone? I mean, turned out for, in my case, there were several guys that I definitely could have talked to. They were coming right outta that same. Same counselor’s office and easily could talk to those guys.

Just didn’t know it. Right? And so, you know, maybe if we just kind of opened up a little bit more and actually shared this with each other, we might actually be able to have a conversation about these things. And you know, who knows? Maybe even take the load off of some of these counselors, you know.

Charles Watkins: Yeah, yeah. You know, and like, I’m very, very I’m a very big critic of the va. My personal experience with the va, I really honestly believe that the VA has done, at least in my. I mean, in my personal opinion and everything that I’ve went through, they have done more harm than actual good. Not everybody, but a, a lot of people.

And I really feel like, like you said, with the taking the gun things, they just, it just came out recently that the va when people were needing a [00:24:00] fiduciary services, they were putting ’em on the criminal system under the FBI. Taking away their guns, you know, and, and, and, and I’m hoping that with this, with, with the new guy coming in, taking over the VA there, that hopefully we’ll see a lot of, you know, positive changes for veterans.

But I mean, like you said, it, I mean, if you need help, by all means go to the va, but at the same time, you may get there, find someone coming out, you know, and, and you may benefit just from talking from them, you know, with other veterans. And, and that’s what we try to incorporate is, hey, you don’t always have to go to.

At the va, you don’t always have to go to a professional. You know, come try this and let’s see if you know it resonates with you.

Scott DeLuzio: That’s right, and one, one of the purposes of this show is to shine light on services like what you’re offering. And there’s countless other services out there. So many. Nonprofits that are focused on veterans and not just nonprofits. There’s other organizations too. But let’s just, for now, if you just focus on the nonprofits, you’re still gonna have tons and tons of options that are, that are out there.

’cause there’s just [00:25:00] thousands and thousands of them. But there’s, there’s so many different options out there that people don’t even realize that there’s stuff outside of the va and they go to the VA once and. They have a one bad experience and they’re like, well, there’s nothing for me out there, you know, because of the VA doesn’t have anything for me.

That’s all that there is out there for veterans. So it couldn’t be in any further from the truth. But there, there’s just so many things out there and, and including, you know, ministries like yours where there are people, like-minded people maybe they’ve. They already have their spiritual world and, and religious and, and their faith all kind of figured out, but maybe they didn’t.

Maybe they, they are just dipping their toe in the water. You know, kinda like you were, when you were talking about that pastor was inviting, inviting you to the service and you kept blowing ’em off, blowing ’em off, and then eventually you’re like, okay, well I guess I’ll go check it out, you know, [00:26:00] and, there, there’s people like that too. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong with anywhere along that whole spectrum of I got everything figured out, which I don’t know that anybody actually does, but you know, they, they, they, maybe they think they do. I don’t know. They feel like it anyways. They, they’re, they’re comfortable anyways with, with their faith and religion.

All the way down to someone who’s maybe just completely not comfortable with it at all. And there’s, there’s that whole wide spectrum of people and. All of them can find a place in a ministry like yours where they, they can, you know, come in and share their experiences, talk about things and again, helping each other out.

But part of the, the, like I was saying, part of the reason for this show is to shine light on organizations like this, because. Not everybody knows all of the the things that are out there. I know. Yeah, sure. We have Google and you can Google, but what are you, what are you really looking for if you’re not sure what you’re looking for?

And that’s, I think [00:27:00] one of the drawbacks to things like that is if you don’t know what to look for, I. Then Google doesn’t know either, you know, it’s, it’s only as as smart as a person on the other end you know, who’s, who’s typing away. So, so that’s, that’s what we’re trying to do here is, is just shine light on these things.

And if you know, you, you feel like you’ve, you’ve tried everything and even been listening to this, this show for the last few years, and you’ve, you’ve tried all the different things that we’ve talked about and you’re like, you know, I, I really haven’t. Given a, you know, good try on my, my faith or my religion or anything like that.

Well, maybe there’s some work to be done there and maybe, maybe you might wanna be open to the possibility of joining a ministry like this, you know?

Charles Watkins: Yeah. And you know, like I said, I, I try to make it so it’s kind of, I’m trying to find as close as I can get to a kind of, just like a OneStop shop. You know, one size will fit all, whether you want spiritual, whether you just want a listening ear. You don’t want spiritual, you know, Hey, come see what we have to offer.

[00:28:00] You know, and, and I’ve, I’ve tried to put it out there to where if, if. People just, I’m like, if you look at the website, there’s a place where you can book different things and hey, it’s all free. You wanna have a session and just talk? By all means, you know, book an appointment. I’ll sit there and talk with you for an hour.

I don’t care. It doesn’t bother me. Not one bit. I had surgery earlier this year and while I was healing from surgery, actually got fired from my job. So, I mean, my days are pretty wide open right now, so, you know, I. You need to talk, you know, set an appointment, let’s talk. But I also tried to, I’ve tried to reach out to churches and, and, and do things with them in different organizations.

Hey, let me come speak to your veterans because, and, and, and I tell this to the churches that, you know. Jesus himself didn’t even reach everybody. He couldn’t be just because of how people are. So, you know, you may be missing some people to where I can come and, and, and talk specifically to that group and we can work together to reach everybody, you know?

And that’s, I kind of feel like that’s what Jesus did was he focused on building a team so that they [00:29:00] could reach more people. And you know, I reached out to ’em, Hey, let me come talk to your veterans. Let’s, you know, start, let’s start tackling this together. You know, Hey, let me come help you set up a veteran’s ministry, get all these guys together.

And you could, you know, you could have your own fellowship group, you know, specifically for people who are, you know, need someone that resonates with them. So, you know, I’m trying different things and, and like I said, I, I made it so that, you know, the website you could pretty much find hoping 80 to 90% of what you’re looking for.

You know, if it’s something outside of of my expertise and you’re like, Hey, I have a drug problem treatment locator. Hey, I need to talk to somebody. You know, like I’m having, I feel like I’m depressed, or I’m having PTSD, you know, bad. There’s a locator for that. So all they gotta do, you know, go on the website, see what you find.

You want to talk, let’s you know, hey, let’s talk. So there’s a lot of different things I try to incorporate there.

Scott DeLuzio: Sure. And, and I I think one of the, the interesting things that you brought up about going to some of these [00:30:00] churches is you’re, you’re absolutely right. I mean, Jesus did kind of build his team of people to go out. ’cause you’re right, he couldn’t reach everybody.

Charles Watkins: Yep.

Scott DeLuzio: mean, he, he still doesn’t reach everybody for all intents and purposes.

Right. And so. He had those people go out and spread that message because I mean, just like any, think about anything that you’ve done in the military, you have a team to go out and, and do it. You’re not like, Hey, you need to go individually, go kick in that door and go, you know, kick that objective yourself.

Like, no, you had a whole team behind you. You know, come, coming in that door with you. Not, not to mention the fact that you also had people who were, you know, in logistics who were handling, you know, making sure that you were, you know, well supplied and you had you know, people who were making the food that made you well fed so that you were able to have the energy to go do that mission.

And you know, spiritual people like yourself who would, would make sure that that. That ground was covered, then you [00:31:00] had a whole team of people behind you. I think I read somewhere, you know, for every one boots on the ground during the Iraq conflict there, there it required like eight other people to provide support for that one combat soldier.

So, I. You know, it’s, it’s just a whole team that you, you need to be able to go in and accomplish whatever your mission is, right? So when, when you’re talking about you know, going into these churches, maybe the leadership in those churches, they don’t really have any experience with veterans or the issues that they have, but they have plenty of veterans maybe in their you know, coming to their, their church and.

It’s for them, it might just be like, well, what do we do? We just lump them in with everybody else. Sure, you could do that. And that might even be appropriate in some occasions. But there might also be some things where it’s like, Hey, I kind of don’t want, like I was saying before, you don’t necessarily want to talk to your coworker you know, in your civilian job who’d never served in the military about military related issues.

’cause you’re gonna come off sounding pretty weird to that person, you [00:32:00] know, sometimes. So, yeah, setting up a. Those ministries within, within a you know, already established church. I think that’s, that’s a great avenue and a great way to get more people involved.

Charles Watkins: Yeah, and I’ve come to find out that it’s tough too because I think I’ve sent out easily 1500 emails and I’ve only gotten a few replies and you know, it’s. I can’t, I can’t figure out for the life of me. Why? Because I try to be very transparent in the emails and, you know, Hey, this is what we do. Here’s our website.

You can go look at it. And I think that a lot of that comes from just people being weary of, Hey, this might be a scam, this might be a fly by night thing, trying to take, you know, take some money from us, or whatever the case may be. But yeah, I’m, I’m, I’m still fighting to try to do my best to, to, to reach him, so, yeah.

But it’s funny you say that about the civilian job. When I first got outta the military, I. Started working for a gun manufacturer and I was assembling firearms. And then we started, I, I moved into the painting department when I got there. Didn’t really talk to anybody [00:33:00] until I heard the supervisor of that department.

He walked over to the machine and he said, this machine has a class three leak. I was like, whoa, I haven’t heard that since the military. That’s crazy. And then found out he was in and after that, me and him, you know, always together talking chitchatting. So it’s when you find out someone else is, you know, a shared experience, it’s a powerful thing.

Scott DeLuzio: It is powerful and I found just through this podcast conversations that I’ll have I you’re familiar with this because prior to us sitting down and hitting record we only really spoke for a couple minutes maybe beforehand. But. You get pretty comfortable talking to another veteran pretty quickly.

And by the end of the conversation it’s like, you know, we, we can talk about just about anything and it’s not gonna seem strange. You know, we can pick a topic and, and we’ll, we’ll go down that rabbit hole and, and it, it’s okay. And so I think like we just have this strange way of bonding together.

Not to say we’re gonna, yeah, every veteran’s always gonna be a best friend with everybody. [00:34:00] ’cause you know, there were some. And quite frankly, there’s some jerks that served in the military too, and you don’t necessarily wanna be best friends with them, but more likely than not, you’re gonna find people with similar interests, similar shared experiences that you’re gonna be able to, to talk to.

And so someone like yourself you know, going into work, not really talking to, you know, any of these people, and then finding out that there’s. Another veteran there. Yeah. Well, you’re gonna start talking with that person. You’re gonna be, I think, naturally you’re just gonna gravitate towards that person a little bit more.

Right.

Charles Watkins: Yep. Absolutely. I was watching a I was watching a video on YouTube the other day, and the guy asked the question, Hey, do you still have that NCO that you ev that you vowed if you ever saw him in public, you were gonna punch him in the face? And I went, yep. I know that guy, you know, but you know that in the military, that guy was, he was a good leader.

He was just, he was very, very tough. But yeah. You know, it’s funny, they say stuff and you’re like, yep, I did that. Yep. I’m gonna do that. Yep.

Scott DeLuzio: I, I can relate. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so it’s those little things that [00:35:00] maybe in the back of your head you have this little scenario played out. But yeah, I’m gonna punch that guy in the face. But. You, you bring that up and like instantly, I, I, I knew what you’re talking about, and I could paint a picture of the person’s face of who that person might be in my, my world.

You know, but you know, I, I, I think that there’s some power in these, in the community, in the, the connectedness of the, the comradery that, that comes from this. And, and obviously you’re, you’re one person. You can’t be everywhere, you know, at all, all the time. But it, it sounds to me kinda like what you’re, you’re trying to do here is, is teach these other people how to fish, if you will, you know?

Tr yeah. You, you can go in and you, you could be that one guy who, who goes in and you know, gets these groups started and. You’re the only person who is there now and forever. It’s only gonna go as [00:36:00] far as you can go. But if you can go into a church and you can help get that, that veteran’s Ministry set up in that church and they can take it and run with it.

Right. And, and you know, I think that that’s, that sounds to me like, honestly the best possible solution because it, it allows more people to benefit from the experiences that you have. And it’s not to say that you completely go away, because I’m sure there’s, there’s resources and support and things like that, which they may not be suited for to be able to handle on their own.

But you may have some additional support services that that. You’re able to provide should they need that down the line, but ideally, I would imagine that the goal is to essentially teach them how to fish and, and allow them to be able to take it and run with it, right?

Charles Watkins: Yep. And, and I look at it like, like to add on to what you said is that there has to be that number one man on the door. Somebody has to go through the door first. And you know, it’s just whether or [00:37:00] not can we get that door down to go in. But I. I kind of feel like that isolation is, is one of the biggest challenges that veterans and first responders are facing.

You know, especially after like transitioning outta service and they feel disconnected from the civilian world even maybe misunderstood and they kind of don’t have a sense of purpose. And, and to combat that, that’s why I’m trying to focus on different, different things to help rebuild and restore.

Give purpose and create, you know, lasting connections. And, you know, it’s a matter of, of, you know, the church is letting us in. I, I’ve looked at the analytics on the website since June. I think I’ve had 1600 vis visitors to the website. Then I had, I don’t remember how many looked on Google, but there was like 18 people that tried to find directions and, well, right now I don’t have, you know, I don’t have like, you know, an office or anything, but the.

With this type of thing. It’s like the, there’s a lot of possibilities. Even I looked at the VA website, you could start a, like a, a welcome center for [00:38:00] veterans. And, you know, I, I tried to bring out the churches, Hey, half the battle of, of getting people into church is getting them into church. We could start this where, you know, Hey, come in, you know, like, and, and, and help them, you know, navigate the VA system if they don’t want to go to a government employee.

Chat with them. Let ’em come in, have some coffee. You already won half the battle right there. Now you just have to convince ’em to come back.

Scott DeLuzio: Right, exactly. And, and hopefully they, they’ve already kind of done that, but they, they clearly have people who do come back and so, you know, they, they’ve figured out ways of doing that. But yeah, getting them in the door, that’s from what I’ve heard is that, is the battle is getting someone to come in the door and, and more than just like your Christmas and Easter you know, once or twice a year, type people. The people who come on at least a semi-regular basis, right?

Charles Watkins: Yep. I’ve been to a church. It was the first church that, that, like I said, that preacher invited me to, it’s it was, it was a smaller church. They weren’t running like super big numbers. And you, you would see the [00:39:00] massive crowds. They would come in at Christmas, they come in at the Easter service and you know, all the different services they have.

And it’s just, you know, it’s, it’s amazing. And, and like you said before, veterans, you know. Being in with the regular crowd, it’s, it’s, it’s a good thing. It’s a positive thing, you know. But I kind of feel like that at some point there’s gonna be a veteran who is not getting all they can out of something and then that’s when they’re kind of gonna turn away from it.

Or if they have a bad experience, it’s then that’s going to prevent them from wanting to try something else. And, and that’s kind of why I’m hoping that, you know, with the website that I built that. There’s a little something for everybody and you know, if there’s something that they feel like they’re not getting, let me know so I can add it.

I would love to get that to you, but I, that’s community and you know, I can’t say that enough. I feel like that’s the heart of everything and, and it’s even the heart of what we did because healing doesn’t happen in isolation. It happens through relationships and [00:40:00] shared experiences and, you know, having that renewed sense of purpose and.

Many veterans and first responders when they, they, they struggle with that. And it’s, that’s why I’m trying to build a place where people can rebuild themselves, their faith, find support, and, and rediscover the mission that they once knew.

Scott DeLuzio: That’s awesome. And I, I think that’s a, that’s a wonderful mission that you have. And I’m actually just. As you were talking, I was kind of picturing you, you had mentioned like a welcome center or something like that for, for veterans. I was just picturing like around Christmas time or Easter, you know, those big holidays that people tend to draw more people to, to a church if even just during those time periods, if they had a, a welcome center for veterans and how, how at home would you feel, you know, walking into a place that you.

You’re going because it’s Christmas and Okay, fine, I’m, I’m gonna go, but I, I know I’m probably not gonna be back here next week. But then you see this, you know, welcome veterans, you know, sign, banner, whatever you wanna call it. [00:41:00] And it’s like, well, maybe this is a place for me. And, you know, for, for those who are out there listening who might be involved in a church this might be, you know, you know, something that you might might want to consider is, is start.

Considering this as, as you’re starting to do your planning for, you know, upcoming holidays and things like that, especially big events where you’re drawing more people in because you, you got ’em in, let, let, let’s latch on and keep ’em in and keep ’em coming back. Right.

Charles Watkins: Yep. Absolutely. And I, I’ve, I mean, I’ve come across, I had a meeting with a church and they’re running like 7,500 people on a Sunday. And I’m like, you know, well, how many veterans do you have here? Do you know? Do you have any veterans groups? No. And I, I, I tried to, you know, get something going and for whatever reason they didn’t, you know, wanna have nothing to do with it.

But I kind of feel like even back to the welcome center, if, if I would’ve had that getting out, maybe things would’ve been a little bit easier. And ’cause like when I first got out, when you get hurt in a combat zone, you get a severance pay if they put you out. ’cause I got medically [00:42:00] discharged and I got a severance pay.

And I went to the VA building they had at the time and I said, Hey, I said, am I gonna have to pay this back? Or, you know, what’s the deal with this? And nobody could gimme an answer. And then the one person who gave me an answer was wrong. And then I just, I never went back there. I’m like, oh, they obviously don’t know what they’re talking about, you know?

And, and maybe I could have gave it more of a chance. But then when they moved and they got a smaller staff and. You know, more knowledgeable people. Then I was like, oh, you know, okay, this is great. Especially the guy that works in, in the county I used to live in that runs the the VA office. He, he would tell you, Hey, this is what you need to get to the next level.

This is what you need to do. This is what they’re looking for. You know, very knowledgeable. But I, I really feel like, you know, if there’s a place where veterans can go just to, you know, just to get a sense of feeling like, hey. If there’s a place for me, you know, like for example, there’s a there’s a place that takes veterans out, shooting trips, hunting trips, sporting events.

I’m like, you know, there’s just seems like the possibilities are endless of, of things you [00:43:00] could do.

Scott DeLuzio: yeah. There are so many things that you could do. And, and I think that’s what I was trying to get across before for the listeners, is that if you think you’ve tried it all, I. You’re wrong. You have not tried it all. There is so many different groups, organizations, like you said, just like hunting and fishing trips and if that’s not your thing, okay, maybe outdoor, like a nature hike or, or something like that.

Getting yourself outside. You know, people who, take people surfing. I, I think actually out in, in your area there, there’s, you know, on the, on the coast there’s, there’s surfing trips and stuff like that that they’ll, they’ll do, they’ll teach veterans how to surf. They’ll, there’s painting, there’s, there’s all sorts of, my gosh, there’s so many things that you can do, but a lot of these things you can start to do with other people.

And when you have that shared interest, not only do you have that veteran connection, but also you have a, a shared interest of whatever this other. Hobby or or activity happens to be you, you [00:44:00] have that extra connection, you tend to bond a little bit easier with that person. So, you know, I have an open mind, I suppose is, is kind of the the gist of, of that message, right?

Now, now for folks who might be who, who have been listening to this and either they feel like a veteran’s. Oriented ministry would be something that is something that they’re interested in for themselves, or perhaps they are a part of a church and they realize, hey, we don’t have anything for veterans at our church specifically for veterans.

We may have like a men’s group or you know, women’s group or whatever, but nothing specifically geared towards veterans. What what’s the best way for people to reach out, to find out more information about who you are, what you do you know, kind of that, that type of stuff. Where, where can people go to, to find out more information?

I.

Charles Watkins: So on the website they, they can go and they can, you can book something on there and like, we could just meet like this, sit and talk. You want, if you’re close, wanna meet in person, fine. And I got a thing on there if you want [00:45:00] me to come to your church and speak, or if you want me to help you establish a veteran’s thing.

I, I put on there, hey, don’t let money be, you know, a, a reason that you don’t wanna reach out ’cause you think, you know, no, it’s free. If you can do a love offering to help with some of the expenses, fine. If not, I don’t care. But there’s that on there. I’m on YouTube at breaking the Silence yt and. You could shoot me a comment on there.

You can you know, shoot me a message on there. I, I kind of got off of social media. I was on LinkedIn for a while. I was on Twitter for a while and, and I was just getting flooded with so much political stuff and I’m like, I’m trying to connect with people, and people were trying to argue with me about different things and I’m like, no.

So I kind of cut all that off. But you know, even, even on the website, I do, you know, different bible studies on there. If you want to connect that way, we can do that. I also have a channel where I do I do responses to people who put out gun control videos. And you can find that at two a pistol.

Pete, you wanna talk guns? Let’s [00:46:00] talk guns. You know, we. Hey, we don’t have to start right away with, you know, mental health and I’m having this problem. Let’s talk. I love talking guns constitution, you know, let’s, so yeah, those are the main ways that you, you can reach out. You know, and if we can establish a relationship, I’m more than happy to give people my phone number.

So,

Scott DeLuzio: Wonderful.

Charles Watkins: yeah. We’re there, but the website, I made it real easy, the 20 two.org. THE two two.org. Yeah. Representing, you know, the 22 Veterans. But it’s I tried to make it easy so people could find it.

Scott DeLuzio: Yeah. Well that’s, I I think that’s a, that’s actually a great website. That, that you got there. I’m, I’m, I’m actually surprised that was still available when, when you got it. ’cause it’s, it’s such a I, I think powerful. It, it’s short, it, it’s easy to remember. The 20 two.org I, I think is, is wonderful.

So, again, Charles, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the show sharing what you do and, and helping helping folks, you know, with their you know, kind of struggles with. Military [00:47:00] service, their spirituality, faith, religion, whatever you wanna call it. You know, all of those things.

I, I think that’s a very important piece of the overall puzzle. And if there’s someone like yourself out there who is able to help I, I think that’s just, you know, an incredible thing. So thank you so much for taking the time to come on the show and sharing what you do. Hopefully we get some people headed your way to, you know, help out in any way that you can.

Charles Watkins: Absolutely. Thank you for having me. And yeah, I’m, I’m here if they wanna reach out. I’ll be more than happy to talk with them.