Episode 489 Jason West Why Officers Eat Last Transcript
This transcript is from episode 489 with guest Jason West.
Scott DeLuzio: [00:00:00] Ever feel like leadership in the civilian world just doesn’t measure up to what we had in the military. You go from an environment where trust, competence, and purpose, where everything to a world where leadership seems more about titles and action, it’s frustrating, right? What if you could take the leadership skills you learned in the military and apply them in ways that make a real impact in your post-military life?
Whether it’s in business, your career, even your personal life. Today’s guest knows exactly how to do that. Jason West is a Marine veteran. He’s a leadership consultant of the company. Officers Eat Last and author of Leadership Development, a Blueprint for Building Your Leadership Foundation. And he’s here to break down what real leadership looks like and why.
It’s not about rank, but about responsibility. So stick around for lessons that will change the way you lead. Work and live. And before we dive in, make sure you head on over to [00:01:00] Drive On Podcast dot com slash subscribe. Sign up for the the mailing list. You’ll get my five favorite episodes sent straight to your inbox.
No fluff. Just the best insights to help you drive on. Now let’s get into it.
Jason, welcome to the show. Really glad to have you here. Looking forward to this conversation, but before we get into it
yeah, just, yeah, I just wanted to welcome you to the show.
Jason West: you to the show. so much. I really appreciate the invitation. It’s, you know, happy to be here.
Happy to be a guest. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, you bet. Let’s talk a little bit about your background, your experience. You’re a Marine. I say you are a Marine because once Marine, always a Marine. Right. But
Jason West: That’s our thing.
Scott DeLuzio: yeah, tell, tell us about your experience and, and kind of your, your. Your leadership journey and kind of what got you to where you are today.[00:02:00]
Jason West: Yeah. I’ll try to tell the, the, the shorter version and then we can dig deeper into some of these other things. But for me, when I, when I was in high school, I was, I was thinking about joining the service and I didn’t know which one or any of this other stuff, but I was also pretty decent at football. And so one of my little dreams when I was a kid was to play football for Alabama. So I ended up having an opportunity to walk on at at Alabama and, and join the football team. So, freshman year going into my sophomore year, I was already getting into, is this really the direction I want to go with my what I’m doing in college. And for whatever reason, the, the Marine Corps. Propaganda marketing machine, what, you know, like you’re not tough enough and you were so mean and all this other stuff. So it really appealed to me. And so after my sophomore year in [00:03:00] college, I I signed up and I joined the Marine Corps and went to Parris Island. So I became a Marine Corps reserve guy. And so, you know, you go through all your training, went back to school. For me, like from a path standpoint, I’d, I’d left the football team. I was like, I’m, I’m gonna, I’m gonna go this other path. And so I’m in the reserves and as you know, like, you know, like not people who aren’t veterans don’t know, but we got an eight year, you know, you sign up for an eight year commitment. And so fortunately my recruiter did not lie to me about every single thing. And so I asked him like, what is the shortest amount of time? That I can actually do. And he didn’t lie. And he said three years. And the reason I say that, I mean, we, we, we know as veterans that the recruiters lie, like, like it’s their job.
Scott DeLuzio: It is their job, I think.
Jason West: Cause it is their job. And I always look back on that. Cause I heard a bunch of other guys is they asked a similar question. What’s the minimum amount of time? And the recruiter would say six years, six years, they were just jamming them into six years. Like [00:04:00] they didn’t talk about any of this type of contract.
It was just like. That’s what it was.
So I always thought it was funny that my guy would like, he actually was honest and he said three years. So I signed up for the three year thing. And so, I actually was finished with my Marine Corps reserve, you know, active time prior to even graduating college. And so I took a job at a bank in New Orleans.
My degree was in finance. And I’m in this bank and I’m doing all this stuff or whatever and wearing my little suit and thought it was cool But the this this calling of the marine corps. It just was like it was on me. So this was 1996 1997 And there was just something And so, I contacted the same officer, selection officer who had tried to recruit me while I was a college student.
I was like, nah, I’m going to go be a banker. And I said, Hey, I’m tired of being a banker. Can you get me? And fortunately he was able to get me a slot, which led me back to the Marine [00:05:00] Corps as an officer. So 1997, go get my commission. And then I’m going into the next step. And you, you may know this through some of your engagements with Marine officers is we compete for our MOS.
At a six month school in Quantico. So, you basically have three contracts. You got a ground contract, aviation, and law. And all the ground guys essentially compete for whatever their MOS is going to end up being. So, I wanted to be an infantry officer and fortunately I was able to get, get a slide as an, as an infantry guy. And then with the full intention of getting out of the Marine Corps after my first tour. So I go do all this stuff and at getting towards the end of my first tour, I met a woman who ended up becoming my wife. And in my head, I was like, well, we’re not married yet, but this whole Marine Corps thing really feel, you know, it’s very dear to me.
So I should do one more tour. And [00:06:00] my second tour was on staff at officer candidate school in Quantico. And then while I was there, I was like, okay, I’m married and I’m getting out. But September 11th happened while I was there. And I was like a lot of guys. Is I was like, well, I ain’t getting out now because I want to, you know, you know, I’m pissed.
We’re all pissed. We’re
all upset. And we’re kind of like, let’s go, let’s go throw some lead downrange and see what happens. So that led me into another tour. The next thing, you know, I’m at my 10 year mark. I’ve been married. I got three kids. And so I finally kind of executed what I thought was my plan numerous times before I left active service and joined the, the, the reserves.
Cause I had been in the reserves that enlisted guy. So for me, I was kind of like, whatever, you know, I’ll just be reserve officer. And so, as a reserve guy, I did a deployment to, into Afghanistan and I know that you were in Afghanistan as well. So. I was there in 2011, January to like August, [00:07:00] September timeframe of 2011. And then I ended up staying on active, like, reserve guy and retired as a lieutenant colonel. So that’s kind of like that path of enlisted officer and then, and then the career track and yeah,
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah. So I, I like it when, when there’s officers who have that that taste of the enlisted side being an enlisted guy myself, it was, it was, I appreciated the officers who had that enlisted experience because they, they just seem to kind of understand the enlisted side a little bit better than some of the other officers, not to take away from the other officers.
I’ve had some great officers you know, above me that yeah. That didn’t have that experience. But you know, sometimes you, you see those that it’s like, okay, yeah, he gets it, you know?
Jason West: it has a big impact for officers when you’re a second lieutenant. First Lieutenant, even your first few years as a captain. What ends up happening after that [00:08:00] though is when you get promoted to Major, Lieutenant Colonel and on, that this, there’s this whole transition in the Major to the Lieutenant Colonel, because once you get to that level, you’re, you’re leading tons of officers.
And so the, this, this strength on the enlisted to officer and second Lieutenant, first Lieutenant Captain. is you’re still very, very close to the men. You’re still very close to like, you know, you’re in the infantry and you’re digging fighting positions, the whole deal, everything. Like you’re right there, like you’re in it. But then as you continue to achieve higher rank, you’re further away
and you have to use, you’ve got to use different skill sets,
right? So the, the second lieutenant first lieutenant captain. If you’re very physically fit and you’re just hammering your unit, physically hammered them, hammering them, hammering, it’s like, that’s okay.
It’s like, that’s part of your thing. But then as you, as you get a, achieve higher rank, you’re also a lot older and you can’t hammer your men. Like, you know what I mean?
Like you just can’t do [00:09:00] it
because by the time you start to be 35, 40, 45, I mean, you just can not operate. The way a 25 year old
at peak performance can operate.
So, that’s my take, is it’s like, you, you, you can see the skill set at a higher level second lieutenant, first lieutenant, but then it’s all, it could be a detriment if there isn’t a transition for whoever that officer is later. Yeah,
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah. Well,
that’s a good point. And actually something I hadn’t really considered, but it makes complete sense the way you described it, because yeah, on those lower,
Jason West: Well,
what’s it? Well, but think about it. Like by the time you’re a major and Lieutenant Colonel is you have E six, E [00:10:00] seven, E E8s, E9s. And in, in, in, in a lot of cases, you don’t even have any E6s around you that much.
It’s not that you, it’s not that you can’t go to a meeting and there’s a staff sergeant and this type of thing there. But as you get higher officer rank, it’s mainly the, the senior staff and CEOs. And there’s a different way to lead them as well. Like you can’t just be like Hey, Sergeant Major, let’s go do more pull ups right now. And I’m going to show you how tough it’s like. Like, come on, like, you
Scott DeLuzio: So Sergeant Major doesn’t want, right.
Jason West: not important, but it’s like, we’re, we’re, we’re doing other stuff here.
Scott DeLuzio: That’s right.
Jason West: doing those stuff where we’re not just like the best guy in the unit is the guy who can do the most pull ups. It’s like, where, you know, once you achieve a lot of higher rank is you, you get, you’re getting paid to think
like that’s what you’re getting paid to think you’re not getting paid to do 50 pull ups.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah. You’re not, you’re not getting paid to do the grunt work, you know, you know,
literally, you know,
Jason West: Yeah. you’re
Scott DeLuzio: yeah, you’re getting paid to think, but the, the, [00:11:00] the reason why I brought that up, because it’s, it’s a good perspective to have, because your leadership style has to kind of change as your position in your,
Jason West: position in Europe you know,
Scott DeLuzio: your, your rank
Jason West: so that’s,
Scott DeLuzio: you know, moves moves up.
So,
So that’s, that’s kind of interesting. So you,
Jason West: you know, the, the
Scott DeLuzio: obviously many different leadership roles anywhere from, you know, the,
the enlisted ranks all the way up through you know, the, the officer level. Got imagine, especially with deployments, some high pressure situations were involved there too.
How did you see that leadership changing as you were going from you know, throughout the different ranks as, as you were going through some of those maybe more higher pressure situations? Transcribed by https: otter. ai
Jason West: so what I would say is when you’re young and you just join. Is it’s about training yourself. So, this, this mindset of self awareness, your ability to train [00:12:00] yourself. So, especially on the infantry side, I know that you were an infantry guy is you need to be physically fit. You need to be mentally and physically fit, and you need to be constantly challenging yourself with that mental and physical fitness. And then, whatever your primary weapon is, you need to be an absolute expert in your primary weapon. And then, as you can, can extend that out, so you can learn the, the M249 squad automatic weapon. You can learn how to employ the 240 golf, and on and on and on, machine guns, and heavy machine guns, and how do mortars work, and how does all this tie together, and how do we get close air support, and just. So, as an individual is constantly challenging yourself to be better, like if you had to do a call for fire mission, what would that call for fire mission be? Like what is a 155 cannon artillery? What are high Mars? What is all this stuff? And it’s so as an [00:13:00] enlisted guy it’s like, how can I keep skilling up, skilling up, skilling up? What happens when you become an officer? Is you’re supposed to be mentally and physically capable. You’re supposed to be at, you know, hopefully at a, at a top tier and all of that, but now is, yes, you can, you can spend time on yourself, but now it’s more about your men. I’m not saying it’s not for a Sergeant as well, because obviously it is, but what you have is you have scale because like a Sergeant. We’re looking at, you know, four soldiers, four Marines, 10, 12, 15, something like that.
But once we move to second lieutenant, first lieutenant captain, we’re talking about 40 soldiers, 40 Marines, 80, 100, 200, 300, and it just keeps going up. And so, on the officer side, from a leadership perspective is you’re constantly asking yourself, How, how [00:14:00] can I assess the combat capability of my unit and it’s the whole thing. You can’t just be like we have two guys who are really good on the two 40 golf. So we’ll be all right.
Scott DeLuzio: Right.
Jason West: Negative, negative, negative. You know what I mean? It’s like, so you’re just constantly asking yourself. What is the physical fitness level? What is the mental prep level? Like all of these things. And and obviously quite frankly, you know, especially once a unit is on the board to deploy is on the, is on the board to be like, Hey, 2010, you’re going to Afghanistan or whatever. And and you’re, and you’re building this plan to get there. I mean, it’s just part of the responsibility. I’m not saying the senior staff and CEOs don’t have it as well, but like you’re, you’re carrying that.
Because you know, you need to do everything you can to enhance the competency and capability of your unit so that soldiers and Marines aren’t killed for incompetence. Cause that, you know, to me, like that, that was my, that was my [00:15:00] bar. I mean, I think it’s, it’s all good officers and senior staff NCOs bar is it’s like the enemy.
We know the enemy gets a vote, but if somebody, if a Marine gets killed, cause we were incompetent, we were lazy, we let complacency come in, it’s like, that’s no go.
That’s that’s that’s that’s no go. And you want to talk about giving somebody PTSD and all the rest of the stuff, be in that situation, be in a situation where some level of incompetence, some level of laziness, some level of whatever got a soldier killed or got a Marine killed. You, you, you’re going to have a problem. Yeah. And
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah. And
the way I’ve always thought of it as,
you know, in my position, I was a E 5 sergeant. So, you know, I wasn’t
at your level, but I had, you know, guys under me that I I was responsible for.
Jason West: responsible for.
Scott DeLuzio: The guys who were above me
were responsible for making sure that I was responsible for
my guys. And, and, and,
it
just kind of expands out [00:16:00] from there.
It’s just, you have more people that you’re responsible for.
Jason West: and if any
Scott DeLuzio: one of those people was not performing up to task or they were being complacent or whatever the case may be.
You know, it’s that leadership’s job to figure out, okay, well, why is this happening and what’s, what’s going on here and why aren’t they getting the training that they need or why are they, you know, whatever the situation is.
So, and I’m bringing all this up because I want to take this
Jason West: Yeah.
Scott DeLuzio: out of the military context for a minute here, because
Jason West: apply
Scott DeLuzio: a lot of great.
Jason West: to
Scott DeLuzio: of great mindset and the way that we do things in the military, I think is really good.
Jason West: a company where
Scott DeLuzio: I think we can apply this now to our civilian lives as we’re either
Jason West: you
Scott DeLuzio: a company where we’re now joining the corporate America or, you know, whatever it is that we, we decide to do in the, in the civilian world, you know, we, [00:17:00] we can apply this, even if we start our own business, we can, we can apply these things as well as we’re building out our team because I think it’s important.
Anyone who’s ever started a business thinking, I’m going to go it alone. And very quickly, they’re going to realize, Hey, you’re probably not going to go it alone very long. If, if that’s your, your mindset, right? So
Jason West: Yeah. So, and I know you know, this and we’ll, you know, show notes and all the other stuff, but I wrote a book leadership development, a blueprint for building your leadership foundation, and that book.
It was, I mean, it’s, it’s kind of, you know, all of my experiences in the military but one of the main Genesis or ideas of it is when I was serving at, at officer candidate school, and this was [00:18:00] prior to September 11th and the whole deal is Wharton business school, and it was because there were Marines in the MBA program, they worked out a deal. To come down to Quantico off cycle because the, the heavy training of candidates in Quantico is in the summer, and then we only do one 10 week winter course and we do one 10 week fall course. So what happens is, is in the, is in the calendar in a 12 month calendar year, there are gaps where there are no candidates there and we have a staff and this type of thing. So anyways Wharton Business School, through some of their foundations and things like, cause I, cause obviously you can’t pay the Marine Corps, but they figured out a way to give a bunch of money to some Marine Corps organizations that in the army has these. That do a lot of things for Marines. And they were like, Hey, we’ll donate a bunch of money if you let us come down there. And what had happened is they, so these, these jokers had worked [00:19:00] together and they wanted to be on, they wanted to be on the buses. So they came up with buses and we sent Marine Corps drill instructors on there and tore their ass off. That’s what they wanted. This was like, okay, Hey man, if you want, if this is what you want. This
Scott DeLuzio: careful what you wish for,
Jason West: yeah, you wanted this and as you might expect, some of them didn’t want it and they freaking quit like very, very quickly, even though it’s like, I mean, it’s like, like you’re not joining the Marines, they’re like, you get over it, dude. But you know, anyways, so like, so the drilling structures that smoky bears, the whole thing, tearing their ass up, put them in the, put them in the barracks, like all of it. We took them out into the training area. They had to run some of our courses and this, this, we got this thing called the Quigley and you got to go underwater. It’s nasty. I mean, just, you know, all this stuff. So anyways they’re doing, they’re going through all of this. And then the end was a normal kind of meal. And and the staff is invited and we’re all like [00:20:00] talking, you know, Hey, that was so much fun, blah, blah, blah. And what you would hear from these business students is you would hear individuals who had been investment bankers on Wall Street. You would, you know, top guys at, you name the company. And they would say, I mean, I was like people that have been in the private sector for 10 years or more. And then they’re going to get an MBA and they go through this experience and they would say that they had learned more about leadership in the last 72 hours than they had the last 10 years. I mean, you, you know, this type of stuff because the army could do a very, very similar thing. So anyways, where my book came from, so I’m on staff and I’m, I’m hearing all this or whatever.
It’s like, oh, that sounds pretty cool. And so, it was in late 24. So all of this was going on early 2001. And then through 2002, three, four, that’s when, that’s when this business school stuff and I was on staff at officer can school as well. So when I was like, Hey, I should write a book. It was [00:21:00] 2014, 2015 when I went head down on it and where I put my head is I was like, okay. if I was in the private sector and there was an individual who wanted to become a leader, what would I do? Like how would I train this individual? And the lens I used was how the Marine Corps trains, infantry officers. So, so you, you have to go to officer Kennedy school. Then you have to go to a six month school.
Then you have to go to another 10 week school, like all this stuff. And so that’s the lens that I wrote the book through. And so the book is essentially. It’s like a guidebook for an individual in private business, if they want to do the work and the way I put it together is yes, it could be me as an individual helping this person, or it could be somebody like you or whoever, and they could just use the book as a guide and say like, okay, you need to be doing this.
You need to be doing this. You need to be doing this. What I would say though, [00:22:00] is unfortunately is what I’ve found. Is that most people do act, actually do not want to do the hard work. They don’t want to do the hard work is like they just, they want the cheat code, you know what I’m saying? They want the cheat code. And I like, and again, I’m talking to an infantry guy here. I mean, I just, it’s not there.
Scott DeLuzio: No,
Jason West: the, you know what I mean? Like, I’m not saying you can’t get a few skills. You can’t like, you know, put a few skills in your pack, but the whole holistic leader. Calm, bearing, professional, demeanor, people will follow him to the ends of the earth.
Takes years and years and years. There’s no cheat code. No, there’s really not.
Scott DeLuzio: not. And when you
Jason West: you
Scott DeLuzio: have somebody who is that type of person where someone will follow you to the ends of the earth.
you know, if I, if I just met you today, probably not going to follow you to the end of the earth. I don’t, I don’t care what your reputation is or what, you know, that that plays [00:23:00] a role in my
decision making, right?
But it’s, it takes some time. You got to build that trust and
and you only do that by Showing that you’re competent, showing that you’re a good leader. And
I
I love the name that, that, that you have here, officers eat last, because
that’s
such a, it seems like such a small thing, but it’s huge too, at the same time, it’s like a simple, simple concept.
But when you have an officer who will wait and watch all the enlisted guys go first in the chow line
Jason West: like,
Scott DeLuzio: it’s like, okay, well that, that guy gets it. Yeah, I know, I know he’s busy.
I know he’s got other things that he needs to be doing. He needs to get through this chow line, but he’s going to make sure his guys eat first.
You know?
Jason West: guy is in first.
Yeah. that’s Right.
So, And so my book is one thing in the name of my management consulting company is officers eat last and how that came about is exactly like you just said. The Marine Corps is really, really big into it. And I know I don’t want to speak for the army. [00:24:00] I know the infantry is closer to it, but the army is so big. You have so many different branches and stuff or whatever anyways. And I don’t want to beat the army up. So like, you know, Hey, go army, you know, whatever. But on the, on the Marine Corps side, since we’re, since we’re a smaller force, it’s easier to kind of just be aligned in a certain direction on, on certain things. But for me is when I was enlisted, obviously I was one of the first ones to eat. Right. So I’m enlisted and I, I. I’ve felt this because, because you could, you could hear your senior staff and COs when you’re in the field, like, Hey, everybody line up and I’m, you know, when you’ve just joined a unit, you’re the lowest rank.
So you’re sitting there and you get your little food and you’re like, yay. I got my little food. This is so great. And then I had the opportunity later, obviously to be the last guy, you know, to be the very last guy, you know, numerous times. And so I’ve been on both sides of this, but I really feel officers eat last. Is a physical expression of servant leadership. You know, you have to do a lot of other things. You can’t just be the [00:25:00] leader that eats last. And then you look at your man and you’re like, look at me, I eat last. So y’all need to do exactly what I tell you. It’s like, it doesn’t work
that way either. You know, but if you, if you can wrap it into your leadership style, your leadership philosophy, like your mentality, and if the individuals you’re leading can see that they, they believe you’re sincere, they believe you’re genuine, then I think it works.
And so. When I was starting this company is I didn’t want it to be Jason West Consulting or I’m the best consultant or anything like that. I wanted it to be something else from a brand perspective and I was just fortunate that the domain wasn’t taken and nothing was taken on the thing. So I just like Grabbed it like it was my job.
So
Scott DeLuzio: That’s actually an incredible domain too, right. Just coming from a technology and website design background and things like that. It, that, that kind of stuff. We, we joke about that. Someone like my friends, just, we have an idea, like in the middle of the night, we just go on, I’m going to buy that domain.
I’ll do something with it. And we ended up having a [00:26:00] stockpile of like 27 domains that we’ve never done anything with, but that’s a great one. You know, but to your point, I think. You’re right. That one act of just, you know, not cutting the line or not going first or anything like that as a leader is.
Not really the be all end all, but if you can tie that
attitude, that mindset into your overall leadership philosophy, that’s, I think where, where it makes a difference. It’s not, it’s not just the act of,
yeah,
I’m going to be the last in line. It’s.
Jason West: run. It’s,
Scott DeLuzio: It’s the, the mindset of,
I’m making sure my guys are getting taken care of.
I’m, I’m going to make sure that they have what they need first before I get what I need. You know, let, let me, let me make sure that they are taken care of. And then that’s when, that’s when those guys start to notice like, hey,
this guy’s all right. You know? And we, we’re going to start to want to follow you to the ends of the earth because
you’re taking [00:27:00] care of us.
We’re going to, we’re going to make damn sure we’re going to take care of you you know?
Jason West: exactly right. And I know you know, this is sometimes obviously you’ll see the senior staff and CEOs and officers actually serve the food. So to
me, that’s, you’re, you’re, you’re raising it up another level right there. And there’s a lot of reasons to do that, to essentially break bread with your men. You’re looking him in the eyes as they’re going through the line, like, Hey, Johnson, what’s going on, Johnson. Oh, good, sir. Good. You know, you know, Johnson’s he’s dumb. So you got to kind of ask him. And then you, you know, you have, you have Rodriguez. He’s smart. You’re like, Hey, Rodriguez, he’s like a high IQ guy.
You know, you know, you know, this, I mean,
you know, this stuff is like kind of, they’re going through the line or whatever, but but yeah, and, and trying to show them you’re a real human and real humans make mistakes. And sometimes they, they do awesome, awesome stuff. And sometimes they do. Yeah. Jacked up stuff, but like, you know, I, I, I know you probably can do this in, in your, in your personal work, but when we come into, into business, is there’s [00:28:00] so many like cool stories here because the whole eating last is if there’s no food left, then the most senior guys get no food, who can fix it? The senior individuals will fix it like that right there. They will fix it quick. Somebody’s getting their butt chewed, the
whole deal. There’s going to be plenty of food the next meal. Don’t even worry about it. But if you, if you flip this around, which I think a lot of times the private sector, we actually do flip it around
and it’s the owners and the most senior people or whatever are feeding at the trough, feeding at the trough, and then the new people, there’s almost nothing left. They can’t do anything about it.
Scott DeLuzio: right.
Jason West: Right. They’re not, they’re, they’re not going to be able to kind of change culture and other, and other things because it’s like, well, there’s nothing left and who are they going to complain to?
Scott DeLuzio: Right, and I think it’s the person who’s feeling the pain the [00:29:00] Who’s going to be able to, or who’s going to want to make some sort of change. Now, what’s their ability to make change? That’s a different story, right? So when that senior guy is the one who’s feeling the pain, because, Hey, look, food’s gone he’s going to be like, well, screw that I’m, I’m getting this done and I’m going to make sure that there’s, like you said, there’s gonna be plenty of food tomorrow and we’re gonna, we’re gonna make sure that this doesn’t happen again, but if it’s a lower guy, then.
He’s gonna be sitting there no food. He’s gonna be hungry and Senior guy is gonna be off. He’s happy because he he got fed He may not even know that that was a problem and then guess what next day same same guy is gonna be sitting there No food and and that’s that’s gonna be a problem. But to your point when you flip it around in the the public sector or the private sector, sorry, when you, when you flip that that around,
Jason West: are not being taken care
Scott DeLuzio: you, you might get that problem where those lower guys are not being taken care of.
And that could be in a whole [00:30:00] slew of different things.
I know we we’re using this as a analogy as far as the officers eating last, right? That’s, It’s just an analogy for the, the bigger picture, the bigger mindset of.
Take care of your freaking guys, you know, take care of your, your employees, take care of your you know, whoever, you know, and, and that’s with anything, make, make sure that they’re being taken care of And if they get taken care of, they’re gonna make sure you get taken care of, you know, those, those guys are gonna, you know, move heaven and earth to, to make sure that whatever it is that you need, you’re going to get, because Hey, you’ve made this job bearable. You’ve made this job you know, provide an income for my family and the benefits for, for you know, my, my family as well.
You know, I had maybe a sick kid who needed, needed that you know, hospital stay and because of the benefits that you provided. They were able to get taken care of, get better and all that kind of stuff. And oh yeah, by the way, I needed a couple extra days off. I didn’t have the vacation time, [00:31:00] but you said, you know what, I’m going to, we’re going to make sure that you get taken care of.
and we’re going to, we’re going to do those things to make sure that
you and your family are you know, being taken care of during this, this difficult time, and we’re going to, we’re going to take care of you, you know,
I’ll even come in and cover a shift for you or something like that, you know, whatever the, the case may be, that’s, that’s the kind of attitude, the mindset that I think we’re talking about here.
It’s not just about a meal. It’s. It’s that overall mindset that, that we’re looking at. Right.
Jason West: Yeah. No, that’s exactly right.
Scott DeLuzio: And
you, and you talked about your book and, and how
Jason West: how these things
Scott DeLuzio: things that you learned through the, your military experience,
and you applied them to your
Jason West: you
Scott DeLuzio: you know, to not just your, but you know, anybody’s experience outside of the military.
Jason West: I, I
Scott DeLuzio: think there, there, there’s gotta be some,
Jason West: maybe
Scott DeLuzio: some lessons, some
real world experience that you had that
Jason West: that Kind
Scott DeLuzio: Kind of made that trigger go off and say, Hey, you know what? That, that would be a good experience. What are some of those experiences that you [00:32:00] incorporated into the book and, or sorry, yeah, into the book and,
and into those you know, leadership lessons,
Jason West: Yeah, so for me, essentially what you’ll find in the book is I believe every leader needs to develop their own individual leadership doctrine. And so with that is they need to define their core values. So the Marine Corps core values are honor, courage, commitment. So if you’re walking around as a Marine. And, and you say, well, my personal core values you need to be careful about how you do that because it’s like you, like whoever you are as a leader is nested. with the Marine Corps, because the Marine Corps says, Hey, our, our core values are honor, courage, commitment. But what do we see in the private sector?
Sometimes a company has core values. Sometimes it doesn’t have core values and maybe they don’t align with you or whatever. But as an individual, this goes back to kind of like self [00:33:00] awareness and really figuring out who you are. And unless you’re a business owner, like if you’re a business owner and I, that’s who I primarily consult with is the business owner is the business owner can align.
The purpose of the business and the business’s core values should align with their personal core values and then that they spread that out. But for an individual who’s like, you know, this week I work for an HVAC company but in a couple of years I want to work at Home Depot and a couple of years after that, I want to go work for Cisco, you know, who knows? So for those types of individuals to me. is you need to create your own personal leadership doctrine and you carry it with you like as you go. So it’s like if you, you take over a team that has five people, you take over a team that has 2030 50 100 whatever is you can start with this framework and that’s what you’re resting your foundation on.
So core [00:34:00] values. Your own individual leadership definition your own leadership traits, your own leadership, principles, rules, like this type of thing. All of those things create a foundation for your leadership. And then obviously any leader needs to know and understand like how to make decisions. And sometimes you need to make quick decisions and sometimes you need to. You need to know and understand how to communicate like there’s all these kind of building block things. So that’s kind of what’s in the book is all of these various building block things that you need to build. But again, it goes back to people don’t want to do like this hard intellectual rigor work.
They just want to watch a YouTube video. Like, cause I, the example I use a lot. Is to me, you can’t be an effective supervisor, manager or whatever of four people, 10 people, 20 people, 30, unless you can effectively run a meeting. [00:35:00] I think it’s a, it’s a key skill. It’s a
very, very key skill to run. And what you’ll find is a lot of individuals who, who take on the role of four people, 10 people, whatever, is they’re not that good at it.
They haven’t done it. They’ve been just the person sitting there taking notes and that type of thing. And so, how do they improve that skillset? A lot of times they just watch a YouTube video and they say like, all right, I’m, I’m rocking and rolling. And. Which that’s, that’s better than nothing, but it’s, it’s not, it’s not a, it’s not a holistic method to become better at that one individual skill set.
And so what I would say is it’s, it’s the same type of thing across all of these various techniques that people need to have in order for someone to say, I would follow that person anywhere. Cause like the, the equivalent of following somebody anywhere. Is when in the private sector, you’re working at Home Depot and Home Depot wouldn’t like this, but you’re working for a [00:36:00] guy and or gal, and then they get sniped to Lowe’s or they get sniped to Ace Hardware and they take their whole team with them.
Everybody, everybody goes with them to me. That’s, that’s the equivalent of followed on many where, and we see it happen, like that type of stuff happens. And why are they, why are they, you know, leaving Home Depot when the sky goes to Lowe’s or whatever? It’s because they’re that fired up to continue to work and share, you know, their, their behaviors and their habits and everything else with this individual.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, that’s a good point because there are those
Jason West: those people who they
Scott DeLuzio: people who they find they have a great leader, you know, boss, whatever,
and they quite frankly, they may not care what company they’re working for. They care about that person that they’re working for. And if that person, I don’t know, they get let go or, you know, whatever. they move on to some other position.
They get recruited or whatever. Oh, hell, I don’t care [00:37:00] so much about Home Depot. I don’t care so much about Lowe’s. I care about working for that person because they make my life bearable in my work life bearable, Right.
But there’s also, there’s also issues to where there are people who a lot of times getting out of the military who struggled to find jobs
or
roles where they actually Give a damn about the type of work that they do or, or, or finding a job that that can use their skills from the military and transfer them over or just find something where they have purpose or meaning in, in that job.
I think the statistics after separating from the military, I think within the first two years, it’s like 80 percent of veterans are already onto another job.
At that point within, within two years. And so,
Jason West: You’re in a leadership
Scott DeLuzio: If you’re in a leadership position, that’s not
great because you’re not, you don’t have, you’re not really building that [00:38:00] rapport with those people.
Like you said, these things take time.
But even if you’re not in, in much of a leadership position
Jason West: there’s an issue
Scott DeLuzio: There’s an issue there, too, because it’s like,
you know, what is it that you’re doing? Because you’re not really building up those skills and building up that resume. Especially if you maybe have several jobs within the first two years, you’re, you’re gone that next.
potential
employer is going to look at that resume and say, well,
Jason West: and say,
Scott DeLuzio: am I hiring you just for another two years stint or, you know, what am I hiring you for here? Right. And so I think there’s an issue there too, where find, not just finding the person that you want to work for, but also finding the,
the type of type of job that you, you want to work for and making sure that it’s actually something that you’re going to stick around with.
Right. yeah.
Jason West: So I know you know this, but when you’re a soldier, when you’re a Marine is every day, you have a purpose because we take an oath to [00:39:00] defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. And most of us obviously take the oath seriously. And we’re ser we’re serving a higher purpose in our service, but we’re also serving a higher purpose in defending the United States of America. And there’s just a lot of meaning in it. It’s all nested properly. It’s all it, it’s, it’s all lined up. I mean, it is, it is.
It is dialed in and certain individuals can say, well, I wanted money for college, or blah, blah, blah. But at the end of the day. Is you’re still serving a higher purpose,
whether you’re getting fired up about it or not getting fired up about it. I mean, you are because somebody needs to go fight the enemies of the United States and fight other people around the world that need to be killed. And there are plenty that need to be killed around the world. And the U S military is happy to do it if we are tasked to do it. So, so what happens as we know. Is when we leave. So whether we serve four years or [00:40:00] six years or whatever, we retire after a longer period of time is the biggest thing that we have to do is find purpose.
We have to find the next purpose. So I don’t think you’ll mind with me saying, so for me is it’s I believe in Jesus Christ, like I’m a Christian.
And so that that’s like a core purpose, which is cool. And that may make you mentally whole each day you’re waking up and you’re not in service. But as we know, you still have to be able to get up and do something. And Jesus would say that as well. Like if you just woke up and said, Jesus, I believe in you. And then you just sat on the floor in your room. Cause you’re like, I slept all night, so I’m going to get out of the bed. He like, even Jesus would be like, Hey. Brother, let’s go like, get on with it. You need to do something.
Cause see, so you need to be in service to others. And I know I’m like, I’m getting deep, but it’s like, you know, it is what it is like, let’s, let’s go deep and let’s, let’s, let’s help, you know, other veterans [00:41:00] mentally and all the rest of the stuff is what are we, when we serve in the military, we are service members. I freaking love it. I mean,
like, we don’t necessarily think about it like that, but like we are in service to others is the United States gets to have the quality of life and everything else. Not just because of us, but one of the reasons is because of us. And there have been some individuals over the last 100 to 150 years who have tried to stop the United States having the quality of life that we have had. And we have had a lot of Marines and soldiers and on and on say like, negative, it’s not going to happen. We’re going to, we’re going to keep rolling with
this, with this constitution. And so to me, when an individual leaves active duty. And let’s just, let’s just fully admit it. I think the, the combat dudes have a little bit more of a struggle because the, the, the combat experiences [00:42:00] are, they’re so intense, the adrenaline, just everything else, and you’re like a jolly green giant, you know, walking the earth with guns and, you know, all this stuff.
And so that transition. After you leave, it is so critical if you don’t latch on to religion or whatever, you still have to latch on to purpose, even if you’re not going to latch on to religion. And so, we’ve already mentioned Home Depot, like you literally can’t attach purpose to Home Depot if you choose to, because what is the point of Home Depot or Lowe’s or Ace Hardware is you’re in service basically to the do it yourself. Homeowner who’s fixing up their house or whatever, and so that’s one of the purposes is
providing those skills, providing those tools, providing these building materials and everything else in order to help someone have a quality home, a quality life, a landscape backyard or whatever. And I mean, I don’t, I don’t care if you call it kind of mind games or whatever, but it’s like play the mind games on yourself and [00:43:00] say, like, I am serving. Is it’s not, I’m not just here for an hourly wage or a salary or anything else. I’m actually here for the reward that people get from having a cool landscape backyard and they bought all their stuff from Home Depot or Lowe’s. And like, get fired up about it. I mean, to me, you can basically do this mapping.
I actually try to like, I do this at officers eat last with any business owner I’m working with is what the first work is about aligning purpose. What is the purpose of your company? What higher calling are you? Are you serving in every single business? Even if it’s ice cream, even if it’s candy. Hell, especially if it’s plumbers, you know what I mean?
There’s, you know, on and on and on,
we, we map this to purpose because that’s how we keep top talent. That’s how we attract top talent. That’s how we create kind of like a holistic thing in any veteran needs to [00:44:00] map themselves to that. And whenever they discount it to me, in my opinion, that’s when they start having the mental struggles, the really, really tough mental struggles.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, I agree. And I know when I got back from Afghanistan, it was, that was a tough time for me coming back. And I, I was in the National Guard. So you’re you’re familiar with the National Guard and reserves and, and,
everything. How, you know, one weekend a month, two weeks a year. So I had a civilian job before I deployed.
That job was still there when I came back. And when I, when I got back to it after being deployed to Afghanistan, having
Jason West: know,
Scott DeLuzio: been in
Jason West: know, Combat situations
Scott DeLuzio: combat situations and things like that,
I worked in corporate finance at an insurance company.
Jason West: That intensity
Scott DeLuzio: That intensity was gone and I just didn’t feel it, you know, and
as you were talking, I was thinking about myself and, you know, if I, Had the wisdom of the older me
and having had this conversation with you way back then [00:45:00] You know things might have been a little bit different, but
in my mind it was like Well, what am I doing here?
You know, I’m looking at spreadsheets and numbers and I could give two shits about it It was just not anything. I really cared about and it was like I didn’t find any purpose Although now that I’m you know, older and wiser and thinking about it in it with a clearer head I could say to myself. Well, hell I was working for a life insurance company and I I knew firsthand You know what?
What happens when there’s that unfortunate situation when you lose a loved one and that’s what we are providing We’re providing that financial security to that that person’s family and
I played a small piece in that You know, there’s
Thousands of people work for the company that I worked for, but
I still played a role in all of that. And looking at it like, well, maybe there’s a sense of purpose and meaning to actually doing what I [00:46:00] do.
And maybe I can find better ways of doing it and I can improve it and make it more efficient. And maybe I can make it so that, you know, the, you know, whatever it is that I was doing. I could have done better for those people, you know,
with, with that clear mind. At the time I, I, I just couldn’t see it.
And and, and I, exactly what you were just describing actually as you were talking, I was like, shit, what a selfish piece of crap I was, you know? But, but that’s, that’s honestly the way, the way I thought of it. And I didn’t last very long in that job after, after coming back home. And I did.
Yeah. Yeah. I, I I just
didn’t see the purpose anymore.
I
didn’t see any value to what I was doing. And quite frankly, nothing against the people, the individuals that I worked with. I just, I didn’t, I felt like I didn’t relate with them anymore. Like they just, they weren’t the same intensity level that I was.
And
I just,
Jason West: super nice people,
Scott DeLuzio: you know, all super nice people, you know, as, [00:47:00] as individuals, I just, as far as
coworkers go, I just didn’t feel like I I fit in there anymore. And so I,
I moved on.
Jason West: difficult. I mean, like it is, it is very difficult, but the, but the first step is essentially getting your mind right.
Like you have to get your mind right. And you have to align a purpose, you have to align a purpose and you have to believe that you are in service to a higher purpose
is critical.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah.
And, and
the thing that I found through conversations like the one I’m having now, tons of conversations I’ve had on this podcast,
things that I found that were the things that got people through a difficult time that they might have been going through is serving somebody else. There’s, there’s some, I don’t know what it is.
There’s some magical trick to it that just gets people through because they’re like, well. You know, I, I need to be here for that person. I need to be [00:48:00] here to, you know, and if it’s in a job, it may not be a physical person that you, you know, personally you know, I got to work in this, at this insurance company because of this person who might need my services and, you know, whatever.
It, it’s for the, the broader category of people, you know, there’s, there’s people dying all the time and they, their families need that, that financial stability. And you know, that’s, that’s the type of thing that our company provided. And You know, that’s just the, that mindset, but it could be anything you mentioned a plumber, right?
God, you middle of the night, you’re, you’re you know, sink just starts spurting water all over the kitchen. You need that person there, you know, and, and, and you’re you know, think about it. If you put yourself in their shoes. You want that person coming to rescue you because, you know, God, God only knows like where, where that, that water’s going to end up and it’s going to end up ruining that, you know, the kitchen and the cabinets and all that other stuff.
Right. So,
you know, you can,
I, with pretty much any job, you can probably point to a
Jason West: you
Scott DeLuzio: you know, [00:49:00] avatar person, you know, that, that you can, you can conjure up in your mind and say, Hey, you know, that’s the person I’m coming to work for. That’s the person I’m doing this for. And.
Jason West: Yeah,
Scott DeLuzio: Puts a little meaning to it, you know, and I, I like the way you, you, you phrased all that.
Jason West: so, when I went to Iraq, I was the assistant operations officer for 3rd Battalion 4th Marines, and I was really big into writing actual operations orders for whatever it is that we were going to be doing. So I ran the combat operations center. And then fortunately had a lot of Marines in there, you know, and I know, you know, this stuff is like, it’s 24 seven, right.
It’s nonstop. Cause that’s what combat is.
There’s no holidays, you know? Yes. Calendar says Saturday. Yes. The calendar says Sunday. It’ll say a holiday actually, but like it’s nonstop
because the enemy. We’ll do whatever they choose to do at any given time. So it doesn’t [00:50:00] stop. But I, whenever we would do specific operations is we would write an operation order and you, you know, you put a name on it, that type of thing. And so what I’ve done with my consulting company is I’ve created, I call it the purpose driven business framework. And the lens I’ve used is very similar to how the Marine Corps and the Army creates operations orders as well.
It’s very similar to that lens. And so, in the, in the naming convention, everything else, obviously, as you might expect, is deliberately done. Because in my opinion, for the business owner and the senior leaders, is first, we need to be purpose driven. We have to be purpose driven. And so whenever I go in with a new client you all, I know, I know you know this. It’s like you have to be you can’t start just casting judgment.
You need to [00:51:00] assess in order to properly move things forward.
So, so that, so that assessment. Is asking about what is the purpose of the organization? Help me understand, like, what, where have you been? Where are you going? And in some situations, obviously a company having a vision statement, a mission statement and core values are very helpful and it’s all integrated. And then other cases, maybe it’s not that helpful. So it’s like, it’s those types of discussions that happen. And then the next level down is strategy development. So it’s like, once we get the purpose, right. So we can go back to plumbers if we have a company and they have 35 plumbers, we, we really do have a purpose driven business and how we’re aligning the 35 and everything else that we’re doing.
Like we are purpose driven, just like I would say, HVAC techs purpose driven. There’s a lot of, there’s a lot of things that are purpose driven, but what, what we need under the purpose driven is strategy. Like what is our strategy? [00:52:00] And strategy obviously should extend out beyond a year, three to five years or whatever. And so I put that into three buckets. I put it into growth strategy, people strategy, operation strategy, and this just kind of organizes things for our brain. And I know, you know, where you would know on the growth strategy side, it’s like, what are we doing to grow the business? What are we doing for our sales?
Like that sort of stuff. And then people strategy, self explanatory. Like. What are we doing with our people? How do we bring top people in all that? And then the operation strategy, we kind of can bucket all the rest of our stuff.
So, so when we go underneath that is it’s about structured goals. Like, what do you do, how do you structure goals and what are you going after in the next 30 days and the next 90 days as a priority for the business, and then the last piece is assessment. And the Marine Corps and the Army are big into this, this cycle. Sometimes it’s called the operations process. But plan, execute, assess. [00:53:00] Plan, execute, assess. Plan, execute, assess in this constant cycle. So what happens is the purpose driven business framework creates a basic plan. And in my, in my opinion, it’s very similar to an operation order.
It’s very similar to a Marine Corps operations order. And then any plan we need to transition into execution because we’re going to have a lot of people involved that may have not been involved in the actual planning. That happens in the Marine Corps, it happens in the Army, it happens on La Crosse because we have so many, you know, so many guys.
And so we need to transition it into execution. But on the front end of the plan, we have to be asking ourselves, how will we assess whether our execution is successful? And obviously the business terms are key performance indicators, KPIs, metrics, and things of that nature. But on the Army and the Marine Corps side, we can use similar things to kind of assess, like, are we actually moving in the direction that we need to move?
So[00:54:00]
that’s, that’s, this, this is like one of my main consulting products that I work with business owners on.
Scott DeLuzio: Yeah, and that’s key too because you you can have goals and strategies. I want to increase sales. I want to, I want to do this and that and the other. But
Jason West: do you
Scott DeLuzio: how do you assess that? You know, whatever whatever that thing is. Whatever the the strategy is, whatever the, the thing is that you’re, you’re trying to accomplish.
Without that data to to say, and now I’m going back to analyzing spreadsheets here. So I guess I’m, I’m just kicking myself in the butt for
ditching that career. but. But,
you know, looking at what what is the metric that we’re we’re going to look at to say, was this successful, you know, is it,
you know, You
know, marketing your marketing strategy, for example, you know, is, is that.
Whatever it is that you’re promoting, is that going to increase sales on,
you know, whatever the product is or the service, whatever it is. You know, and then
how do we know, and how do we track that and all that kind of stuff? [00:55:00] So there’s
a whole lot of
things that go into all of that, but And I’m sure that could be a whole nother conversation, you know, as far as all the details that go into all that, but but I think, you know, a lot of this conversation has, is really focused on you know, these leadership principles and, and things.
And I, I think it’s important because ultimately for, for the listeners who were out there listening to this conversation
I
want them to know that they, That those skills though, that leadership skills, whatever level that you are in, I don’t care, you know, even if you’re lower enlisted or, you know, all the way up to,
you know, a senior officer level you’ve developed some sort of leadership skills through
Your military career
And those things are applicable to
your future career. But just like you were saying earlier at the beginning of this conversation,
Jason West: You have
Scott DeLuzio: you have to continue working on those things because,
sure, being an enlisted guy
[00:56:00] going to an officer as a,
you know, you know, a one, two, three, you know, those,
Jason West: those those enlisted
Scott DeLuzio: those enlisted skills that you had as you were, as you’re working still closely with those
enlisted guys,
Jason West: those were
Scott DeLuzio: were still applicable, but as you moved on and you, you grew in your career, they became less and less important.
It’s still important to have, but they weren’t
Showing up on a daily basis, probably. It was probably you know, more,
you know, maybe a couple of times a month that you might need to tap into some of those things, But
you need to continue expanding, grow your skills. And I think that’s just an important thing for people to think about is not to just be static.
Like,
Hey, I’m a veteran. Come give me a job and, and kiss my ass because I’m you know, so, so awesome or whatever. It’s like, that’s. not the case. People aren’t going to do that. And, and you’re going to need to continue evolving and growing and, and everything from,
from the time you get out
till the time you retire.
That’s, you’re, you’re going to have to keep
evolving yourself [00:57:00] and, and learning more and doing all these things. So, I think important messages important concepts to take away from, from this conversation is that continuous evolution and growth
of of yourself throughout your career.
Jason West: Of yourself throughout your career. Is it’s about your actions, like it’s, it’s, it’s constantly your actions.
So, fortunately or unfortunately, when we’re serving on active duty in the army and the Marines is when we walk in the room and we’re a sergeant, everybody’s like, Hey, this guy’s a sergeant, like immediately.
And when you walk in the room, when you’re a Lieutenant Colonel, Like, Hey, this guy’s a lieutenant colonel, and like, you’re, you’re giving immediate credit and reputational credit, and then you either you either build it up and enhance it, or you freaking tear it down because it’s like,
if you walk in the room and you’re a turd, then it’s like you’re, you know, you’re, you’re, you’re eating away at your whatever you were given immediately. But in the private sector, when you walk in the room, I mean, you know, like [00:58:00] you’re nothing, you’re just some dude, you know, some, some dude or gal walking in
Scott DeLuzio: the same as everybody else,
Jason West: Exactly. And, and it’s like, there, there, there’s nothing, there’s no, there’s no professional courtesy. There is absolutely, there is nothing. And,
Scott DeLuzio: Nobody stands when the CEO walks in the, in the room, right?
Jason West: And. It’s like, it’s like all of those things, you know, all of us have to transition. So I, I I’m very proud that I was a lieutenant colonel and I’m, I’m retired as a lieutenant colonel, whatever. But I know that I have to demonstrate through my actions, whatever I’m doing, like that’s it. I mean, and there are individuals who will say, colonel West, what do you think? And they say stuff like that or whatever it is. That’s. If that’s their thing, if that’s what they wanna do. If they do it a lot, I’ll say, Hey, my name’s Jason. Like, let’s, let’s just roll. Let’s just roll with it. You know, it’s just Jason, like, let’s, let’s do this. Because, you know, you can get the flip side where people are just straight [00:59:00] up disrespectful. You know, there’s, there’s, there’s, you know, nothing. And I’m not talking about military. I’m just talking about like human behavior,
Scott DeLuzio: Mm
Jason West: And you have to, you have to get over that as well. You have to, you have to just. I mean, as a consultant, obviously, I want to work with business owners and this type of thing, but if there’s a gatekeeper and she’s like, you know, you need, you need to buzz off, he’s not going to talk to you. Can I just, can I chew the gatekeeper out? No, I need to, I need, I need to buzz off, I
need to buzz off and then, and then, and then, and then circle around, you know, in a different way to try to get to, to try to get to the business owner and and you know, I can leave and then just start crying that the gatekeeper kicked me out and blah, blah, blah.
And I can sob or whatever I want to do, but in the private sector, that’s what a gatekeeper, they get to do that. If that, if that’s what they want to do. [01:00:00] Yeah,
Scott DeLuzio: that’s not going to win you any favors with them. It’s not going to, that’s not going to move you
closer to the goal line. Right.
Jason West: goal That’s Right.
Exactly. Exactly. And it’s like, it’s all those things that obviously all of us have to work, work through as we transition.
Because if you’re walking around as a Lieutenant Colonel and you walk into some building and there’s a Lance Corporal or a Sergeant. And they’re like sir, they’re not seeing anybody today. You’re like, Hey, go, go get your boss.
Like I’m, I’m done talking to you. Like go and get somebody else. And they’re like, okay, sir. They go get
Scott DeLuzio: And then it just happens, you know, and that’s
Jason West: And then a bunch of people come out and they’re like, Oh, I’m so sorry. We, we made you wait for 30 seconds in
this. Like, yeah, don’t do that again. All right, cool. Let’s go. Let’s go.
Scott DeLuzio: Right.
Jason West: All of That’s gone
Scott DeLuzio: That’s gone and and that’s I think that’s part of the evolution too as you as you’re learning
You know, where do I fit in in this new world here? You know that hey that you don’t you don’t have that rank on on your on your [01:01:00] collar or your shirt You know, what? You don’t have that on anymore. And so
Jason West: I got it. I got a gray goatee.
So I do have that. So
that at least that at least establishes that I’m not young.
Scott DeLuzio: right exactly Yeah.
So as you get, as you get to that point, then, then maybe maybe people give you a little wisdom credit, but you know, that’s, that’s about as close to any sort of rank as you’re going to be pulling
Jason West: But nothing else. They may, they may give me the grandpa get out of here
credit though. So
Scott DeLuzio: That, that may, it may backfire. Who knows? Before we wrap up I want to just give you a chance to let people know where they can find out more information about you, about your your consulting company and your book think things like that, where people can go to find all that information.
Jason West: So, the best place to buy my book is to go to Amazon. If someone wants a signed copy you actually can buy a son signed copy on my website, Bye. So at officers eat last. com and [01:02:00] then if you want to watch me on video more for whatever reason you can go to YouTube. I have a YouTube channel and would be happy with, with any of those things.
So if a million people watching your podcast right now, I want to buy my book. I’m, I’m happy. Amazon will be happy. Everybody’s happy.
Well,
Scott DeLuzio: happy if there’s a million people watching this podcast too, that would be amazing.
Jason West: Exactly.
Scott DeLuzio: but yeah, well, you know, when we get to a million people watching this, this, this podcast, we’ll definitely get them over there buying, buying the book. That’s because there will be all these links that you just talked about.
It’ll be in the show notes and you’ll be able to check it out there. So, awesome. Well, this, this conversation has been awesome. You know, definitely got, got the gears spinning in my head and, you know, hopefully some of the listeners have kind of. Taking to heart some of the things that you had talked about you know, especially with regards to leadership and the
application to their civilian careers and, and how the, they can,
you know, really change that mindset to be more of service to people [01:03:00] regardless of what the career position happens to be.
So,
You know, I think this has been an amazing conversation. I really do appreciate it. Thank, thanks so much again for taking the time to come on.
Jason West: Same here. Scott. I appreciate it. Thank you for the invitation. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. it.